Antique blue and white platter

Stan · Sep 27, 2014, 20:58:23

Also, it looks like the dots on the double lines were printed and that is what is making up the lines, lots of dots, if the mark is printed then the whole decoration on the tea pot might me printed.

Stan · Sep 30, 2014, 09:37:46

The collectors view point, I was pumping the appraiser for bohnams for information, he said what sells best here is pieces that have animals on the porcelain, he said that collectors prefer animals other than people, and that the porcelain with animals sells at a higher price, he might have a point because I have been looking for plates like this one for a long time and have never seen one until now, the only places that i see them is in books and I was told that this platter is extremely rare.

peterp · Sep 30, 2014, 10:17:57

Yes, right Stan. There is really no need for holes when drawing a circle. Overall the mark image gives the impression as if there were very faint chatter marks below the glaze. But a hands-on inspection would be appropriate to make any verification.

As regarding the decoration, the Chinese generally prefer items with people, landscapes seem to be popular too. Animals are of interest if there are deer with other auspicious objects, but there seem to have been fewer of the latter.

Stan · Sep 30, 2014, 10:52:31

That must be a western thing with the animals, at lest from Bonhams view point, his very words were who would want to look and people, they would rather look at animals.

peterp · Sep 30, 2014, 11:03:09

Its mainly the auspicious meaning that attracts people when it comes to animals, here. Your plate is full of auspicious meanings. The deer, the crane, pine all have auspicious meanings, as does the buffalo with the boy. Contrarily, I have had a plate with two water buffaloes, but that seems to have been of little interest, probably because that meaning was lacking.

Stan · Sep 30, 2014, 12:12:31

Thats interesting, auspicious meaning, thanks Peter.

Stan · Sep 30, 2014, 13:49:05

Calder, are you going to show us the rest of the tea pot?

calder · Oct 01, 2014, 06:18:14

Yes Stan - Pics below.

Stan · Oct 01, 2014, 07:30:06

Hi Calder, this looks like Banko ware to me.

peterp · Oct 01, 2014, 08:09:21

It is a fantasy creation, nothing traditional.

kardinalisimo · Oct 01, 2014, 08:17:12

Interesting. I did not know that pieces with animals are more desired.
Speaking of the meaning of the depicted scenes on the Chinese porcelain, I think every single piece has a meaning. Absolutely every one.
I started to make a data base with all the patterns, animals, people, objects, borders, plants, trees, flowers etc. I was surprised to find out that a very big part of the decorations are about the Chinese Imperial examination system. Then another huge part is related to auspicious meaning, longevity, good luck, happines etc. Every combination involving bats, fish, flowers, animals etc has a meaning.
I am using mostly Chinese sources and I find it very difficult to translate the meanings. It appears that there are a lot of homonyms in the Chinese language and that is how the name of the patterns are made.
Stories from the Three Kingdoms are also common on the older pieces. Scholars, immortals, legends ... I feel like I need a whole year to study everything.
Hope that will be helful one day

Stan · Oct 01, 2014, 19:28:24

Hi Kardinalisimo, That is quite a task that you are you are taking on, to try to log all the patterns, animals, people, and ect, that could take a life time, Im sure you will learn leaps and bounds in doing so, I wish you the best of luck, it is projects like that, that eventually turn into books, sounds like it would be a good book to buy, when finished.

Stan · Oct 05, 2014, 07:59:53

Hi Kardinalisimo, how many 18th century porcelain items have you seen with several animals portrayed on the porcelain, not very many, i see them in books or museums but they very rarely come up for sell, I did not see one at bonhams when I searched under Chinese export porcelain, maybe that is what the appraiser meant.

Stan · Nov 01, 2014, 13:15:39

Hi Peter, I showed this platter to a Chinese women that appeared to be vary knowledgable, told her that is was Qialong period and she said that she thought it was much earlier, she said the blue color was from an earlier period.

peterp · Nov 01, 2014, 19:21:37

Maybe she thinks it is a certain blue color that was only used for a short time in the Kangxi period, and then never again? Could be...
I have been evaluating Kangxi, but two or three things speak against it. There are no withered tree(s), at least not as far as I can see. The mountains are not very typical for Kangxi either.
To me the decoration has no features that are very clearly indicating Kangxi; but the body has a feature that is very important for determining if a bottom could be Qianlong. My personal view.