Another Blue Bowl

[kardinalisimo]

This one shows more wear that could have been faked. Don't know if the base is darkened to  make it look old or for other reason. There are two  large characters.

[Stan]

Hi Kardinalisimo, I know that in the Ming dynasty that some of the bowls and plates were coated with a paint on the bottoms and would have had a dirty look to it, I have a bowl that came from the hoi an hoard ship wreck which was over 500 years old, the one I have you can see swirls from the paint brush that looks like it was done on a potters wheel, the color on mine is a dark brownish purple look but it is not on the foot just the inside of the foot on the bottom, after looking at mine more closely, the blue on yours is the wrong color for Ming and there would be crazing in the glaze in areas which I am not seeing, the blue color seems to dark, I wonder if this could be a fake. lets see  what Peter says.

[peterp]

This is what the Chinese call "dragon over the wall", because the tail is usually on the back. Items of this period and type exist both with unglazed or "sand" bottoms, as well as with glazed ones. Imitations with sand bottoms are frequently artificially made to look dark gray or dark brown, whereas it is difficult to clean the false dirt. In this specific case the plate looks authentic. This is from Dehua kiln, Fujian province, from about mid-Qing dynasty, in my view.

[peterp]

Ah, something else...this is not a bowl but a plate. Plates with a flat outer rim are of western origin and appear mostly on Chinese export porcelain. Domestically used Chinese plates were made with an upward bent, round rim.

[Stan]

Thanks Peter, I have a vase that has similar characteristics as Kardinalisimo's bowl, I am glad to hear that it is authentic because I wondered if mine was real of fake, I will post it some time. I like the dragon.

[kardinalisimo]

Peter, the tail's tip is round. Maybe later than Mid Qing?
I see quite a lot of flaws that could be natural or faked. What does the two characters read?
By the way, is that porcelain or stoneware?
Thanks

[peterp]

Yes, seems to be later. I didn't pay attention to the tail. Cannot read the characters, either because of the angle, or because the strokes have disappeared. That was written on the finished bottom, with ink. Such markings often appear on excavated (burial) items.  Chinese porcelain does not know "stoneware", that is a western classification. There is a character now to describe it, in Chinese, but traditionally only porcelain and earthenware are recognized. Some western institutions classify certain porcelains as stoneware, but I think this is porcelain.

[kardinalisimo]

Here is another photo of the characters. Hope it can help read them.

[T. Chan]

Dear Peter, is the base darken on purpose in that period? If not, why is it so dark? I have never seen a Qing with dark base, but it looks natural. Or maybe it was found in the mud and still has not been clean? Thanks.

[peterp]

This one looks natural. If it were fake, it were uniformly dark all over.
Unfortunately, I cannot tell for sure which characters these are.

[Stan]

the characters could be the owner of the vase that marked it so no one else could claim it, kind of like when you put your name on something that you do not want anyone else to have, I have seen similar marks on mid Qing porcelain.