An Yongzheng imitation of an earlier piece.

[heavenguy]

Hi, I would like to know your guys opinion on this vase. At first I thought this could be a republic period piece but once I started doing research on it I think it could be a period piece or maybe a little later. What bothers me is that extra line one the Nian character. Translucent and really well done. 

[heavenguy]

here are some extra photos. thank you so much

[heavenguy]

oh by the way I forgot to tell you the color is more like the picture im holding the piece. some sort of light blue. thanks

[peterp]

Without giving an opinion on age I tell you what I see when I analyse items, for consideration here ...

- The glaze is too shiny - usually it can reflect the light but should not mirror objects (lamps, windows) clearly in the background; there are some exceptions
- The foot rim shape - it looks rounded like a worm back, but has a line on the outside (only); could be it was shaved there or the glaze contracted, but it is neither an average private kiln nor official kiln shape
- The foot rim colour - basically in more ancient times (Song dynasty) certain kilns' monochrome items used very dark clay, even under a light glaze. This was considered superior wares for the court, etc. Here the clay is that colour, but it is dyed. This is often found on imitations, but does not necessarily mean an item has no age. You can see that abrasion or the small chips expose the white/gray clay body.
- The mark - I know little about Yongzheng mark details other that the large majority of Yongzheng marks was written in kaishu characters not zhuanshu. This applies for both imperial and private kiln wares. There may be exceptions. This is zhuanshu.
On the other side:
Yongzheng is known to have had many ancient items (pre-Yuan) copied, some had the character 仿 (copy) in the mark, but not all had that.

Take your time researching this. Sometimes it takes years until suddenly something similar comes up or a clear revelation appears to tell us either way.  :-)

Almost everything above may have exceptions, you will have to look into these too, and consider any age signs not visible in pictures.
I wouldn't be too concerned about the mark strokes, some have variations.

[heavenguy]

Peter thank you for your reply. My dream has always been to find the good stuff, no matter the odds. IMO I got lucky this time. The estate I went had some really nice items. I found a few receipts and some appraisals on some of the items I got. I will attach a piece of provenance of some of my items censoring personal information of course. (It's not from this piece but at least I know she got good advice from reputable people.) I also know the bank took the best stuff but IMO I got lucky on some, so for me the provenance its good. Don't worry I know all the variants and that people can make mistakes, but is not the same finding an antique on a thrift shop than finding it on the house of the millionaire in town. Anyways...

I hope this link will solve most of the questions on this vase: https://asia-archive.si.edu/object/F1946.24/

Mine it's a little bit more shiny but so the one on the link, no matter how opaque they say it is it also shines on their photo. Mine is 6 1/2 inches tall but on the link it's 4 inches tall. other than that, I think I got a match, lol. Found it by accident.
www.bonhams.com/auction/28439/lot/221/a-pale-blue-glazed-ru-type-mallet-vase-yongzheng-underglaze-blue-four-character-seal-mark-and-of-the-period/

www.alaintruong.com/archives/2020/01/04/37914034.html

www.bonhams.com/auctions/13745/lot/3232/

www.bonhams.com/auction/28125/lot/8/a-very-rare-ru-type-vase-yongzheng-seal-mark-and-of-the-period/

most of them show similar seal marks, fine grain porcelain foot rims with the dyed Iron-oxide foots and similar foot rim shape, and even glossy glaze like mine.

I order a couple of books to try that were used as reference to try and learn more about the pieces.


1.- Oriental Ceramics, Vol. 10: The World's Great Collections - Museum of Fine Arts, Boston
2.- Chinese porcelain of the 19th and 20th centuries Hardcover – January 1, 1977 by H. A. van Oort (Author)

Still, I will try and gather more information to see what else I can find.

Thank you for your observations, It helps me improve my knowledge on Chinese antiques. Hard to learn about Chinese antiques when you live in the middle of nowhere.

[heavenguy]

OK, just a small update. 

according to the similar piece I found on this collection: 
https://asia.si.edu/explore-art-culture/collections/search/edanmdm:fsg_F1946.24/

I finally got my hands on this copy "Wang Qingzheng. Yongzheng Imitations of Guan, Ge, Ru, Ru and Jun Wares. vol. 22, no. 2 Hong Kong, February 1991. pp. 54-59."

What I don't understand is that the side the piece is is consider guan ware but with Ru-style glaze.

According to the publication: 

Imitation Ru wares pieces from the Yongzheng have the following qualities:

1.- The Majority of of Yongzheng imitation pieces are glossy and transparent with numerous pits on the surface.
2.- spur marks are cylindrical
3.- footrings are either arch shaped or in the form of of a faceted arch.
4.- MOST bear the underglaze-blue, six character seal scrip mark. but there are exceptions from the imperial kiln or the private kilns form Jindezheng that have no marks at all (they require further investigation since they might be protoytpes.)
5.- common shapes includes bottle vases

Imitation Guan wares pieces from the Yongzheng have the following qualities:

1.- two groups of imitations, one has cracked celadon glaze and iron colored foots. The second group have ogreish-blue oe Clair de lune glaze either with or without small crackles.
2.- same marks as above
3.- most guan imitations have a finely pitted surface.
4.- with a few exceptions have a smooth base with no sand adhering to them.
5.- footing is either rounded or faceted arch.

So I guess I'm 90% sure it is from the period, but since I'm no expert I might be wrong, lol.

thanks for the help.