Wallvase-like porcelain, 20th century?

Started by damyp, Dec 22, 2023, 03:54:55

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Hello, here is an interesting object but I have some doubt it might be from the 20th, especially the golden border of the "card" in the center of which the script and the painting is done. Qianlong mark at the base.

It seems to be a copy of:

What is your opinion?



Looks as if it (the border) could have been re-painted. Not so much because of the color but the uneven space between the lines. If you look at the other, thinner ones, the space between is even despite they being smaller.
The base has some problems. Might be from usage.
This can not be further evaluated without a hands-on inspection using a magnifier or microscope, etc.

This said, it might be made at the same place like the one on Alain Truong's site, but the above mentioned problems could be a reason for them being discarded (?).

We also need to be aware that some items made by the imperial kiln in the Qianlong era were becoming private property. On request of Tang Ying, the kiln overseer, the emperor had agreed that items with quality problems from production were not supplied to the palace, but instead disposed of (probably meaning sold) to the people by the kiln. Previously, the best of a batch made would have been selected and the rest destroyed.


Thank you!

Also, when I'm seeing closer the borders of the golden card, I can see that it's in relief, whereas in other pieces of wall vases (like the one on Truong's website), the border is fully painted and no relief can be observed! This is something that made me doubt its authenticity, but your obversation is weighing on my opinion now and it could maybe have been made in the same Qianlong kiln but discarded.

Something interesting too, is that on the neck of my vase, the two foliate patterns circled by the ring are tied whereas on the 2 wall vases on Truong's website they are separated. This can be understood as : the both faces reunited in one unique vase, foliate patterns are tied.

Maybe if the vase was a fake copy destinated to be sold, they would not have done such a work.


Here is 2 other objects I have doubt about:

First is a doucai cup with the Chenghua mark. What i'm doubting about is the floral patterns: it seems to be the exactly the same all over the  4 sides.

Second is a dish with characters on  the base (Shunzi mark?). Blue/White with copper-red. Presumably early qing period.

What is your opinion? Recent objects?


Well, I would doubt the one on the left too. The way the leafs look is a bit odd considering that this probably would be imperial ware. Especially if it should be doucai. Doucai has underglaze blue contours which are clearly visible, normally.

With the second a direct side view might show the foot rim shape. In my mark book the Yutang Jiaqi mark would be Ming, but there are some Shunzhi, Kangxi that have similar meanings.
Ladies started to be painted in decorations in the Kangxi reign. Thus, regardless of any marks, etc. it could not be earlier. Kangxi ladies are usually slender and tall; the way the rocks are painted also resembles a Kangxi style.
However, with Kangxi plates the foot rim is usually slanted on the outside, with an unglazed surface. This is not clearly visible here.