Guangxu bowl

JjGhandi · Nov 28, 2020, 08:14:05

Hello everyone,

What are your thoughts on this Guangxu bowl?
The 5-clawed dragons would mean this is an imperial piece.

The glaze seems quite white however, hence my doubts.

Thanks in advance.

Kind regards,

Jj

JjGhandi · Nov 28, 2020, 08:14:37

More pics

JjGhandi · Nov 28, 2020, 08:15:11

More pics

peterp · Nov 28, 2020, 12:53:54

The five claws rule seems to have been relaxed in the Guangxu reign. I cannot see anything that would speak against it being of the period. If the image shows the real whiteness, then it should be normal. Look at the white dots in the decoration, or take a piece of printer paper to compare. That would be too white. :)

JjGhandi · Nov 28, 2020, 16:47:52

Hi Peter,

Thanks a lot!
I didn't know about the five claw rule being relaxed, that's very useful info!
Is there any possibility to determine imperial wares of the Guangxu reign?
Except for the finesse of the mark, pottery and decorations?
Could this be one?

Thanks!

JJ

peterp · Nov 28, 2020, 21:06:20

Not for sure, because private kilns could make anything, even high quality items and marks like the imperial wares, theoretically. As during the Guangxu reign the court also ordered porcelain from private kilns, some of these would have the capability to produce high quality wares similar to imperial wares.

Does the foot rim have a worm back?
Is the mark aligned with the pearl between the two dragons, in this case?
These are normally conditions for imperial ware.
In addition, with Guangxu imperial ware more often than not would have an underglaze blue six character mark like this one. That is all I can say about this.

JjGhandi · Nov 28, 2020, 21:57:42

Hey Peter,

Great info, thanks.

The seller is asking a hefty sum, around 1.000 USD.

I'll definetly need a hands on inspection first to check these criteria (alignment, wormback).

Kind regards,

JJ

peterp · Nov 29, 2020, 09:49:52

A thousand is not much if it really is imperial...

JjGhandi · Dec 01, 2020, 22:03:39

Hi Peter,

I just received more pictures.
I uploaded them here because they're in a better resolution:
imgur.com/a/FduwXlo

Foot rim:
imgur.com/a/2uLmz6R

What do you think? The mark seems to point to the flaming pearl but the foot rim doesn't seem to be a worm back.

Thoughts?

thanks!

Jj

peterp · Dec 02, 2020, 08:02:26

The foot rim shape is usually best visible if it is photographed at an angle of about 30-45 degrees, rather than straight from above. The other image does not show it clearly either. But in the picture showing it from straight above it looks as if it was round (worm back).
Anyway, imperial or not, such quality would be quite normal for Guangxu items made for palace use. In the Tongzhi and Guangxu reigns quality did not equal that of the Qianlong reign. One reason was that the imperial kiln was destroyed during fighting with the Taiping rebels.

I can only help you that far without hands-on inspection. You have to take the risk yourself with every purchase! :)
You should also make sure that there are no repairs or hidden cracks with the seller, if they only provide these pictures.

JjGhandi · Dec 02, 2020, 13:59:18

Hey Peter,

I went and bought it yesterday, I couldn't resist.
It's absolutely of the highest quality.
The painting is magnificent.

It doens't have a worm back, the mark points slightly off the flaming pearl but I have to agree with you that the quality of the piece is very, very good. It's also in pristine condition: no cracks, hairlines, chips,... whatsoever.

I am really happy with this one!

Thanks for your advice :)

Kind regards,

JJ

peterp · Dec 02, 2020, 20:23:36

Congratulations. A fully decorated bowl of this quality is not easy to find even among late Qing items.

Stan · Dec 03, 2020, 02:55:43

Hi JJ, I thought I recognized the decoration, I have a bowl similar, mine has a Daoguang mark in the Zhuanshu script, but the mark is slightly off being aligned with the flaming pearl also the thickness is 0.79370 mm, almost egg shell, awhile back I won a box full of porcelain at a local auction house, and this was one of the pieces in the box.

Stan · Dec 03, 2020, 02:57:40

Here are the last two photo's to compare.

JjGhandi · Dec 03, 2020, 06:13:09

Hey Stan,

Amazing, I haven't seen the decoration anywhere before.
The only difference seems to be that mine is more decorated.
Mine has gilt in the orange dragon, does yours as well?

Mine is thicker as well.
When held into the ligjt I can only see through the base.

Kind regards,

JJ