a ming earthenware

[heavenguy]

any opinions on this? I was reading that it could be ming. A lot of people put them as a 19th century jar but doing more research I ended up on a museum and another website where it says its a jar that was  sold to thriving Chinese communities living in Southeast Asia.

it is kind of large 9 inches tall by 11 wide.

[heavenguy]

more pics

[heavenguy]

las pics thank you in advance

[Stan]

I'm pretty sure this is a late Qing storage jar, the color was typical for that period.

[peterp]

I have never seen this decoration in Chinese porcelain. But then, what we see are mostly items from mainstream kilns. I would suggest to check if you can find it among Martaban jars. Many Chinese collectors do not even know that these exist, because they were not sold in China itself,  but they were transported from South China to the Burmese port of Martaban. The name comes from this, but not all Martaban jars are Chinese. The Burmese kilns did also export jars from the same place. If it was really made in China, this would be more likely from a less known southern kiln.
BTW, this seems to be earthenware.

Please post if you find out what kiln this is from...

[heavenguy]

Hello,
Yes this is earthenware. I know the regulations about posting links to other places, but if I may, this is a place where they kind of technically explain the piece.
[link removed by admin]

I also found a similar piece in a USA museum inside a collection but totally forgot which one, it also said it was a Ming. I like the part in which they mentioned that they were so highly revered by people that shaman's used to take a piece from the Jar and eat it for medical or religious reasons. That could be the reason why most are chipped and that could explain the nick it has at the bottom of my jar. Only bad thing is that my wife likes this one and she wants to put it inside our living room and she doesn't care that could have been used as a burial object.

I know that there is a lot of website that says 19th century but like Peterp said, it looks like they just mimic what other people said. Weird thing is that there is even another website that they mention that the designed was based on ammonites, and they date this jars to the yuan dynasty.

Anyways thank you all, if I ever find more about this I'll be to put it right here. Thank you

[peterp]

I cannot say that it IS a Martaban jar. It just could be one, IF it was made in China. One thing that speaks against it is its shape, as the majority of those jars have a different shape. It could as well be from any other kiln or place. Unless you find one with a similar decoration in a museum or documented by a reliable source you can not be sure.

As regarding it being possibly a burial jar, I doubt that. Burial items are usually put in the tomb with the deceased, but these are of small size. Yours would be too large for that. There are places where they place the dead inside jars, but those need to be larger, especially the mouth. Just keep looking and earlier or later you will find a similar one. But keep an open mind, in case it is from another place than assumed.

[heavenguy]

Thank you Peterp... I will order a book on the subject. Learning is the best thing we can do. I'll do my best to research this one.

[Stan]

I have a large Jar vase that I had appraised, it has the same color, the same bottom and the same color inside, the inside on mine looks almost as it they used tar or some kind of black coating, the appraiser said it was a storage jar and is late Qing, mine has dragons and other distinct Chinese designs.

[peterp]

Stan, yes there are lots of large storage jars, and here many were in use until a few decades ago. The black lining inside may just be some sort of glaze; whatever it is, it used to prevent leaking as water or liquids in unglazed earthenware would penetrate the clay. Such jars were made in many areas. The problem is the decoration, which is unusual for China. There may be some lesser known kiln producing this, but unless we can find the same decoration it is difficult to identify really where it is from. We should not forget that other countries in SE Asia and Korea, etc. also produced storage jars.

[heavenguy]

Hey guys,

I was reading this reference online study "The Collection of Chinese and Southeast Asian Jars" made by Dr. Eva Str?ber , about Martaban jars and it has some really interesting information. It talks about how they were made, origins and that is a subject that is gaining popularity. They say that they are currently studying Kilns in Southern China and researching the Shards found on those places to have a sense on which Kilns they made some jars.

She also mentions that the kilns near Guangdong province offer lower prices for this Jars so it was better for the people who offer their wares to foreign markets. So basically, they are the most common. The brown glaze with different shades of brown was very common since the tang dynasty.  They also started to put designs in this jars since the tang, but they got popular in ming and Qing. Especially the dragons you mention. I think some other country really like this because it had a different meaning than in China. With vases like this, i think is best to ask around and really search around because is like Peterp says, its really kind of a new topic and most experts won't even know about some of these pieces. Some names stick to some pieces like how people call ming bowls to this double happiness bowls.

Anyways, I recommend reading this book because it looks that she did her research. And it only takes like an hour to read.

[peterp]

You are welcome to post the link to the file. I think that museum is above doubt.

[heavenguy]

Hello, this is is the link to the page.

https://www.princessehof.nl/en/collection/research/

You can download the PDF for free. They also have a large collection online of over 3000 pieces but for some reason the collection is online at the moment.

Hope this helps.