Famille verte late qing Jar?

heavenguy · Mar 15, 2016, 03:38:50

Hello, I found this cool piece. I'm not sure what are those parallel lines that go horizontally trough the piece. Could be the turning wheel marks made by the maker? Also the foot rim is not as slim as other pieces I seen. Thank you in advance.

heavenguy · Mar 15, 2016, 03:39:15

more pics

heavenguy · Mar 15, 2016, 03:39:42

more

heavenguy · Mar 15, 2016, 03:40:21

the foot rim. is it normal that is that of a red in color. Thank you in advance.

Hmm · Mar 15, 2016, 06:47:28

Not positive, but I believe the year 1922 is written on there. Looks like ??.

peterp · Mar 15, 2016, 09:28:43

Without checking on the decoration too this could be anything, even a fake, with fake date, etc.

heavenguy · Mar 15, 2016, 09:55:56

Bummer. I keep on buying this fake things. I try my best to look at the foot rim, Kiln defects, decoration and I still... it seems that they fake everything. There is simply to many fakes in the market to be doing this thing right. oh well, thank you guys. I will learn from this too.

peterp · Mar 15, 2016, 10:35:46

> it seems that they fake everything

Yes, that is right. That is why we need to look at all the features of an item, to check if faking is involved. Sometimes it is just a later made item, but the more features are checked, the higher the probability of finding the right age.

Here, probably 95% to 99% of all Chinese porcelain offered is fake or new. This percentage is much lower in the west, but so is the number of items available. Check all item features and do not buy if in doubt. The urge to buy no matter what is difficult to overcome, but is essential to become really proficient. And it is necessary to analyze the features of each item, no matter whether authentic or fake.

Stan · Mar 16, 2016, 01:49:29

I bought a pair of these from an antique dealer that brought a container full of Chinese porcelain back from China recently, same decoration, faces outlined in black, mine has a nicer shape though, I did not pay that much and I do not think mine are more than 40 years at the most, but the quality is very good, there is a lot of these coming from China that are not that old, the writing looks to fresh on yours, you would think that 1922 the writing would have some wear, and not be black as if it was recently made, but it could have set on a shelf without handling, I have a vase that has some history dating back to the early republic with similar decoration and the faces are drawn in black, but mine has nice age signs as well, and the writing has fading as well, I think a hands on inspection is needed, unless you can take some close up pictures of age signs, pitting, rust spots missing glaze in spots any of these would help to determine age.

Stan · Mar 16, 2016, 01:56:46

Sorry guys, I did not know that your photo's can be enlarged , they appear to have nice age signs, I wonder if the writing could have been added later.

Hmm · Mar 16, 2016, 09:09:09

Hmm. I find this somewhat disturbing. If I found this piece in one of the antique stores around here, I wouldn't really hesitate to purchase it if the price was good. I know I'm inexperienced, but it looks like the right age to me, and nothing looks particularly off, except maybe the bottom foot rim? Although I would just think the bottom is just a little bit odd, because I haven't seen enough foot rims.

peterp · Mar 16, 2016, 09:24:27

The bottom is dirty, but may still be okay, but I still have doubts. I would advise to be careful with such items.
As Stan said, the writing is too black, the cyclical date would be 1922 or 1982. The body seems to be old, but I have doubts about the condition of the painting. Overall the colors are just too perfect. This motif and style is quite common. I also have a few, but they all show lighter colors and more or less severe abrasion. Here again it is possible that a faded motif on an old item may have had its colors refreshed by over-painting.
Look how the gilt at the tip of the lid knob is abraded from handling. But the black of the hair and clothing is still pitch black. It should also have been abraded a bit from handling.

Please note that without hands-on inspection I cannot be sure. This is my assumption.

heavenguy · Mar 19, 2016, 04:28:51

Well, I pick this up for 60 dollars so its no biggie there. I bought this because it really shows some age in person (in my noobie opinion). I clean them with soap and water before taking pics (I don't know if that's good) just to make sure they didn't stain them or that they put dirt on it so it will look like an older piece. I mean I know I have made a lot of mistakes but I'm kind of getting the grasp of this.

With the characters do all of them have to show signs of wear? I mean, some people really do take care of their things. I know that most stuff can be damage with time but I think that a few items escape the conditions of time. especially with senior people. They always put their stuff on Curio cabinets and stuff.

Anyways. Thank you for your replies.

peterp · Mar 19, 2016, 09:29:57

With abrading or faded I do not mean from washing or scrubbing, or use.
Among all on-glaze colors gilt decorations are reduced the most easily. Gilt requires an extra firing at low temperature, after everything is done. However, just touching or handling it with the hands may affect the integrity of the color. Rubbing by the fingers or perhaps acidic perspiring skin may be just enough. In my experience black is next to gilt in this view. It is just unlikely that all the black decoration survived that long without the least effect on these colors. The foot rim and jar opening do not look as if they were not used since manufacturing. It is just unlikely ...

heavenguy · Mar 19, 2016, 11:59:02

Okey, i understand what you are saying. That explains a lot and it makes sense. That will help me decide on future purchases. that you very much.