Is this a genuine Guangxu mark?

[newcollector]

I bought this yellow and green enamaled bowl with a Guangxu mark on it about two months ago, at a tag sale. I've compared the mark to ones on the Sotherby's web site and it's very similar. And the bowl itself has everything you'd expect for that period. I'm fairly certain it's genuine, but I'd like people with more experience than me to check it out. So, what do you think?

[peterp]

If this were an authentic antique it would have to be imperial ware. However, generally the work isn't right, quality-wise, not even for general Guangxu period items, in my view. The green background is very uneven, in places even covering what should be yellow (see claws of dragon, and the shape is not clearly followed.) The rim is smeared with green paint.
Again, in a calligraphic sense the mark is lacking and not in the correct position, either. The right column shows characters where the top character "da" is smaller and the bottom "guang" character is larger than it should be.
I'm afraid this is a more recent fake.

[newcollector]

That's disappointing to hear. I'm starting to wonder if anything I've collected over the past few months is genuine. I'm going to upload more pics of the things I have to find out if they're real. Thanks again Peter.

[peterp]

It is advisable to spend a fraction of what you use for buying porcelain for buying books and other learning material. It is said that some collectors of ten or twenty years end up with a house full of fakes. Today, when perhaps 99% perhaps of what is being offered is fake or new, knowing what to look for is more important than ever. I recommend to start with collecting Chinese export porcelain. Chances that you get authentic items is higher, at least at this time.

[Stan]

Hi Newcollector, don't feel bad, I have been collecting for over 30 years, and until I found Peters web site I did not know the difference between Chinese and Japanese porcelain, I thought my Japanese porcelain was Chinese, and thanks to Peter and this web site, I now know the difference ,  so I strongly emphasize you read everything on this site for starters and you will have a good idea about telling the difference between the old and the new, but I still get in trouble now and then, especially with the early republic, some of the porcelain looks as if it were made today, and the fakers now a days can fake even the  most experienced collector.

[shelley Kong]

My view about collecting antique is: Either we grew up in an environment of antiques, ( family collecting it) or we go to school on antiques ( do they exist?), otherwise, we will have to learn by collecting fakes ( a sort of tuition fees). But that's a long, long process! Peter offers good advice but he doesn't have hands on. So I wonder if Peter knows of any serious conf?rences on antique Chinese porcelain.

[peterp]

I may not do hands-on inspection on YOUR antiques, but I do have opportunities enough with mine and other's collections, and yes, I do attend related "meetings" were antiques are appraised. But, as I said, without books on the subject you may never get anywhere with Chinese porcelain.
There is a pretty clear difference between those who just learn by buying genuine and fake antiques (=experience) and those who go still deeper by reading (!) (=theoretical and peripheral knowledge). Having the feeling that an item is antique is one thing, but knowing why it IS antique or CAN NOT be antique requires a lot of peripheral knowledge. Possibly more than any school or course could teach.

[Stan]

Hi Shelley, I did not grow up with antiques but I was fascinated by the Japanese and Chinese blue and white antique porcelain, I own a lot of it, 30 years ago it was cheap, if I knew what I know now, I would have collected better pieces, Peter offers, free of charge, B.T.W. a service out of generosity what most people would charge for, and I can say I have tested him with the best, Bonhams, and Christies, appraisers , Peter passed with flying colors, I think he accedes their appraisers in knowledge, because he reads Chinese and Japanese, That being said, when we are told that our item is new or even fake, it is hard to take that we were burned, Peter dose say, when he gets an item of importance that a hands on inspection is needed because of all the fakes out there, face it 99% of what is for sale is fake, and I will say it again, if it was not for this web site I would still be collecting blindly, Thanks again Peter, for your expertise, you have save me a small fortune in fakes.

[shelley Kong]

Dear Peter and Stan,

Of course, when I say Peter doesn't have hands on, I mean only the porcelain that he is doing free for us, out of kindness and a passion for antique Chinese porcelain. How I wish Peter was there when I was hesitating whether to buy those " antiques" and when I am looking at my collection. The doubt is always at the back of my mind. If only there is a "teacher" like Peter who can explain to us in person the feel, the touch, the weight of those items, and the age signs.......
By the way, I have a childhood friend whose father was a high officer of the Kuomingdong and she said she used to be surrounded by antique porcelain in her house and drank and ate from Republican period and sometimes Ching dynasty cups and bowls. She can tell instinctively fakes from real but can't explain like Peter who is really Professional!

Shelley

[Stan]

Hi Shelley, Thank you for your comments,  I would like to side track a little, You had mentioned in a prior blog that you went to some Chinese art school where they are selling new Chinese porcelain and that it was selling for big bucks, could you ad-lib on the subject please. If it is selling for that much now do you think that they could be tomorrows best antiques?

[shelley Kong]

Stan,
I think I said that while I was in HK last October, I went to the Chinese Art and Craft department store to buy a Chinese dress and ended up on the floor where they sell Chinese antiques as well as excellent modern pi?ces. All were very expensive. A 33 cm vase antique or modern, is easily priced at 3 or 4 thousand euros. The huge store was almost empty, with about 30 sales people and only 1 or 2 people browsing, so I Wwnder who is buying them.
Shelley

[Stan]

Thanks for sharing that, Shelley, I went to a local auction last week, they had several Chinese porcelain vases, they all looked new to me except one and a pair of vases that I bought that were mid 20th century, there was one vase that looked to be late 19th century, all the new vases sold of $3500. or more, I was amazed, they were online buyers.