Pear shaped Jiaqing Vase

[JjGhandi]

Hello everyone,


What do you think about this yellow pear shaped vase?
Could it be of the period?

Another one was sold at Christies:
www.christies.com/lotfinder/Lot/an-important-and-very-rare-yellow-ground-famille-5379931-details.aspx
The colors in this one are however different. The mark is also a bit different.
The neck is also a bit thinner it seems.

Is this a 20th century copy? Or could it be genuine?

Thanks in advance!

JJ

[JjGhandi]

More pics

[peterp]

I do not want to judge this as it could be either way. There is a limit to evaluating authenticity by pictures, and this is it.
If this is a copy, it is a top quality imitation. But it is impossible to tell...the example at the link you provided is imperial, whether this is depends on the painting quality.

If you have access to it, compare painting quality. If it is imperial, painting quality would be about the same. But please be aware that today's fakes also can be of very high quality, and they may be expensive. Then there is the possibility of a later Qing dynasty copy, but would it use the the Jiaqing mark?
Is there a foot rim with a worm back?
You will note that the green bottom is darker than the auctioned one. That is normally a sign that it is later in the 19th century at the least. In the Qianlong reign the greenish color would be lighter I was told, but upon checking I found also that there are some with darker color are recognized as imperial. I do not know much in this respect about the Jiaqing reign. Quality would have been at a similar level as in the Qianlong reign, at least in the first years of that reign. If possible have someone do a hands-on inspection.

[JjGhandi]

Hi Peter,


What worries me are the contours of the vase.
They're all black. As for the Christies one the contours differ in colors.
For example the bat. That has orange outlines.

What worries as well is that these blakc contours are still so vividly black.
In the Christies one the edges are often partially faded.

[peterp]

I did not even note this, because these pictures are too small to show fine detail clearly. But, that is indeed a thing that would concern me. I cannot say black outlines did not at all exist, but the prominent black contours found on 20th century items are mostly absent. It would really be necessary to also inspect the glaze using a microscope or magnifier, in my view. The decoration and colors are only part of it.

My advice is to stay away when in doubt. I know that is sometimes difficult when something rare seems to be in reach, but for me this was and still is one of the most important lessons learned. We will never be able to judge all types of ceramics accurately, and being able to stay away when there is even a tiny doubt is part of the buying/collecting process.  :-)

[Stan]

Hi JJ. if you were to go online to any of the high action houses you can view imperial vases and see high quality photo's or photo, they give you enough to see the imperial quality of painting and the colors used, look under " past Lots " one thing Peter has taught me that stuck is to examine the details, from comparing yours to the High auction ones, is yours is a reproduction, yours is a good one, but the quality is just not their, that is the colors are not inside the lines and are a little sloppy compared to the ones you can view, Can they duplicate Imperial porcelain, I think so but yours including the mark is not quite their, in my humble opinion. BTW even the High auction houses can be fooled.

[JjGhandi]

Hi Stan,


Peter & you are both right.

When it's too good to be true, it often is.
The quality of the painting is indeed just not the same.

I'll pass, thanks again.


Kind regards,

JJ