Guan-Type Vase

[GerryG]

Hi all, I am hoping someone can provide some more information regarding a vase I purchased recently. It has some good characteristics for Guan ware. Certainly not song but maybe Yongzheng or perhaps Guangxu. definite evidence of ring pad on base used as rest during firing which excludes anything before Chenghua. Too thickly potted anyway for early Guan ware. Iron red has been applied to foot rim though there is evidence of same showing through glaze on lip of vase which could indicate red slip being applied to base and lip of vase to simulate Song period manufacture. Glaze is lustrous. Crackle has been dyed very prominently suggesting use of oxide rather than charcoal. Dimensions are 10 cms in diameter by almost 19 cms in height.

Thanks for looking. Any comments are welcome.

regards,

Gerry

[Stan]

the bottom looks strange to me, there is to much orange color, it looks like it was applied,

[GerryG]

Hi Stan, well spotted. Certainly this was one of the initial things I noticed when first looking at the vase. Upon investigation it seems Song and Yuan guan ware was based on a very thinly potted orange/ high in oxide clay with several layers of glaze applied often more glaze than clay being the case. The item would also have been fired on three or four trivots leaving spur marks. When Guan ware was reproduced from the Chenghua reign onwards, the potting became thicker and the clay was white porcelain with red slip sometimes applied to the base and top to simulate the color effect showing through that was a characteristic of Song Guan Type porcelain. Also later pieces were fired on a ring pad which seems in evidence on the piece I have displayed here. Some of the finest pieces of reproduced guan type porcelain  was made during the Yongzheng reign (1723 - 1735) in the Qing dynasty. Most of the more inferior pieces would have been made in the late 19th and early 20th century. I guess what I'd like to ascertain is if my vase shows any indicators of belonging to either category.

[peterp]

Hi, I don't think this would be Guan ware. Guan has much wider crazing, normally. This one might correspond to Ge ware, but the rim shape looks as if it was about Qing dynasty at the most.
This would be Fangge ware (=wares copying original Ge ware ). The rim and bottom could be provinding important hints, but there should be closeups of these.

[GerryG]

Hi Peter,  Thanks for your reply. I cna certainly see why you might think this vase is more Ge-ware though my initial hesitation was founded on this vase only having one set of crackle whereas most Ge-ware would be known for two sets, one prominently dark and the other less noticeable orange or golden (gold thread and iron wire) Now I know this isn't and exact rule and certainly reproduced Ge ware in the Chenghua and onward reigns applied red slip to the foot and mouth of vessels to simulate Song period Guan ware so you could have a point. I've attached two more closeup photos for your review.

[T. Chan]

Hi GerryG, as far as I know, the paste that exposed for guan, usually dark brown to almost black. I have never seen a guan paste like that.

[peterp]

Perhaps Qing dynasty Fangge ware, but the orange color is a bit unusual, so not sure without a hands-on inspection.
You could upload closeup pictures of both base and foot rim (really close), showing any faults or blemishes. And one or two more overall views of the vase showing how the crackles are distributed all around.  I am looking for a general direction of some crackle lines.
May be that helps somewhat.

[GerryG]

Here's a few more pics I hope will give you a better view of the foot rim and overall pattern of the crackle.

Regards,

Gerry

[T. Chan]

Hi Peter,
Just curious, why the crackle pattern is spiral on the neck, just like the Song similar globular vase? Thinking that the body is much thicker. What makes it this way? Thanks.

[peterp]

That has nothing to do with the era it was made in. It is related to the turning direction of the wheel, when it was made. It could mean that it turned counter-clockwise. That may or may not affect authenticity. Normally, Chinese wheels  turned clockwise, but there were exceptions I hear.

[T. Chan]

Thanks Peter. You are best. So this explain why it usually has spiral crackles too inside the neck.